AS Seen On

By: Stephan Spencer


Dr. Donese Worden
“If you want to be whole, you have to get to this place where the body can heal itself because your personal pharmacy is far stronger.”
Dr. Donese Worden

Donese Worden, NMD, is a physician, researcher, and global health educator who bridges science and spirituality. She is renowned for identifying and helping bring unique modalities and therapies from abroad to the United States, putting her on the vanguard of integrated medicine.

In today’s episode, Dr. Worden focuses on how she encourages her patients to feel a spiritual connection. This has been crucial for cancer patients, those with anxiety attacks, people with chronic pain, and more. When you tap into the spiritual energy that surrounds you, you experience the infinite healing your body is capable of.

Dr. Worden explains the various ways she hears from the Divine, including her lucid dreams. We discuss the importance of having the willingness to be used by God on a daily basis. She even leads us in a special meditation exercise you won’t want to miss. This episode will ground you in the very real connection between science and spirituality. 

In this Episode

  • [00:38]Stephan introduces Donese Worden, a physician, researcher, and global health educator. She’s renowned for bringing unique modalities and therapies to the United States, making her a vanguard of integrated medicine.
  • [06:00]Donese talks about one of her patients who had a breakthrough from plugging into his spirituality.
  • [11:12]Fear disappears when people develop a connection to something outside themselves.
  • [17:43]Donese talks about Conversations with God by Neale Donald Walsch
  • [24:00]Donese walks the listeners through her breathing exercise.
  • [29:25]Donese shares about the guided meditation she created with her husband, Barry Goldstein
  • [33:51]We all have ways of connecting with our spirituality and receiving messages from God.
  • [38:33]Stephan shares a story about a person who gave a large tip to a waitress after feeling a nudge.
  • [43:13]Donese shares her love for science and why she bridges it to spirituality.
  • [44:42]Visit Donese’s website, call her office at 480-588-2233, and follow her on Instagram and Twitter to learn more about how you can heal yourself by connecting with your spirituality.

Jump to Links and Resources

Donese, it’s so great to have you on the show. 

Great, thank you. I appreciate it. There’ll be lots of fun. Whenever we met through business meetings, we said, okay, there’s a much deeper conversation that you and I can have. From Stephan to Donese, we’ll do some good work here for everybody.

Yes, and I’ll tell you it’s been such a gift having you in my life and you’ve really made a big impact. Why don’t we first start off by letting our listener know how you ended up going from functional medicine to spirituality, and how you bridge those two worlds? In some ways, they are diametrically opposed—allopathic medicine and then the woo-woo stuff—and yet they go hand in hand in my opinion.

If you want to be whole, you have to get to this place where the body can heal itself because your personal pharmacy is far stronger. Click To Tweet

Correct. As a naturopathic medical doctor, I’m licensed in both systems of medicine—allopathic, pharmaceutical surgery, that kind of thing. But from day one of medical school for me 20 years ago and beyond, I was learning the importance of environmental medicine being licensed in traditional Chinese medicine, in homeopathy, in clinical nutrition, and mind-body which is counseling. 

It was always important from the beginning. Even within the scope of a naturopathic medical doctor, spirituality was the word or the thing that you just didn’t quite talk about, even though it was underlying there. But it was always important to me and from day one on my intake, which is that first paperwork that a new patient fills out (or a client if they’re not in Arizona), is that I ask, do you have a spiritual connection? 

I’m not asking about religion. I’m asking, do they feel connected to something outside themselves? Twenty years ago, people didn’t quite know how to answer or they were a little more reluctant to talk about. Nowadays, people are so ready to talk about it and say, you know, yes, I understand that this is important. I’ll have people that will say, “I do my rosary every day or I pray every day.” I said, “But that wasn’t my question.” 

Do you feel connected?

My question is, do you feel connected? Do you really feel that sense of peace and connection to whatever your belief system is? Not for me to tell you what your belief is, but do you feel connected? It’s surprising the number of people that still really have a hard time with that. They cry and say, “Well, I’m doing all the right things by the book, but I don’t feel connected.” I let them know the importance of that in their physical and mental health, how that affects that.

And how does it affect that?

100%. If you want to be 100% holistically whole, you have to be able to get to this place where the body can heal itself, because your own pharmacy is far stronger, better, there are no side effects, it’s the right dosage. What we make in our body is the best medicine, the best pharmacy in the world. It can’t make that and it won’t make that if we’re running from the bear, which means we’re in survival mode, we’re under stress, because we’re not in a peaceful mode, or we’re in fear and anxiety. And a lot of those emotions come from not having a deep, spiritual connection. 

When we can tap into that, whatever’s going on in your life that could throw you for a loop into a stress response, as long as you have the ability to have practice, that can get you back to that moment of breath, peacefulness, it’s all okay. It allows the body to do its own self healing. Now, that doesn’t mean I don’t get my prescription pad once in a while. There’s time for an injection, there’s time for supplements, there’s time for those things, but in general, a lot of things are band aids. We want the body to heal, we’ve got to feel we can’t live in fear and anxiety, and we’ve got to be able to feel peace, and that’s coming from a spiritual connection. 

You sit on a counseling couch for years, and remember, I’m licensed in counseling. That can be good. That can give you tools that can help that, but unless you’ve gotten to the point where you’re really, really feel connected, I find that people can’t get to 100% physical, emotional, mental health without it.

What we make in our body is the best medicine.

Do you have an example? You can anonymize it, of course. If other patients or clients who had a big breakthrough because they got plugged back in to that connection. 

Right, or plugged in for the first time. What came to mind when you said that, I had this contractor, this young male. He was probably 35, had a young family, big guy, works out, tough guy, runs his crews. He came and was having panic attacks, anxiety attacks. He said, “Dr. Worden, you’ve helped me before with so many things. I trust you, I’m here.” I said, “Well, are you ready to go someplace with me that you may not have been able to go?” He said, “Can’t you just give me a pill to take care of this?” I said, “Well, it might take the edge off, but it’s not going to take care of it. What’s causing it is where we’ve got to go.” 

I asked him. I said, “Will you do some breathing with me? Just do a breathing exercise with me.” I taught the one that I do. You imagine the breath coming in through the bottom of your feet out through your heart, top of your head out through your heart, and entering your heart. We’re breathing, we’re slowing down, and having him visualize. I thought, well, at least I can give him just a moment of peace, but when we stopped that exercise, he was literally in tears and said, I have never felt so peaceful in my life. I didn’t even know what existed. That allowed him to feel for a moment, what tapping into this energy or this process of being connected could do for him. 

That changed his life. It wasn’t a shot, it wasn’t a pill, it wasn’t a supplement that I could get him. Yes, I can support him with many things, but to fix the root of the problem, if you keep going back and you ask, well, why do I have this? Why did that symptom come? You keep going back, there’s always an emotional component attached to all diseases. Even if you broke your leg, there’s an emotion attached there. Until you attack that or look at that, we’re missing a big piece of medicine. How do we address that? It’s really through not being afraid of finding a spiritual connection, whatever that may be.

One thing I learned recently that surprised me, I learned this year is that all disease has an emotional root.

I won’t say a root, and here’s why. If you’re in a car accident, and you break a bone, I’m not sure it was an emotion that caused that to happen, that bone break, but there is an emotion now attached to the fear, the pain, all that attached to that break, that needs to be addressed so the bone can heal properly. But there is an emotion attached to all physical. Cancer patients, which I see a lot of—I worked a lot in oncology—there’s fear. Not just anxiety but an underlying deep fear of facing death, and we have to go there with that. Even all the wonderful metabolic cancer therapies. 

The human body can do so much when giving it what it needs and taking out what it doesn’t.

I just got off the phone a minute ago with an oncologist, top oncologists from a San Francisco group and a mutual patient of ours. With those guys, I can’t bring in necessarily so much a spiritual connection. We’re working on the physical. Even though it’s metabolic, it’s unique, it’s different, we’re analyzing what we need to do in processes. 

The client has already made that connection with me. She already trusts me, she knows me. When we’re on the same page, we’re able to bring the oncologist in. By the end of having a conversation of an hour with them, they trust me because they know I know my science, they know I’m not going to put something that will interfere with any treatment that the patient has chosen with them with conventional care. I understand the world, I will not interfere and I can make it synergistic, and they trust me by the end. 

We set that stage—the patient and I—for the oncologist to learn and trust the recommendations that I’m making. I work with some of the leading oncologists at MD Anderson, and work with researchers at City of Hope. They’re open to it. They just don’t discuss it. We’re bringing it to the table because I’ve got that connection with my client or patient.

Okay, got it. Let’s say that the patient or client has a pretty extreme fear of death. I know I did up until my spiritual awakening. What would be a way that you would address that for somebody who is agnostic?

I let them know what we have found by the statistics. Not just the statistics in general, but in my patient population, those cancer patients, no matter what stage they’re in—stage four terminal, you’ve got two weeks to live—there’s always a survivor. There’s always someone who beat the odds. Call it spontaneous remission, call it whatever you want, there’s always somebody. 

They have such a connection to something outside of themselves.

What they all have in common is that they are no longer afraid of cancer and they’re no longer afraid of death because they have such a connection to something outside of themselves. They have felt it, they know it, and they know that they will always have that whether their physical body is here or not. 

Once they get to that point, the fear is gone. The anxiety can come and go—it can—but that deep underlying fear of death releases and lets go. There’s not even agnostic patients. I say maybe it’s breath, maybe it’s feeling, but as long as you’re only connecting to you, and that’s your only belief system, the best healer I know is you connecting with a source outside of yourself, just to give you the peace that you need for the body to do the repair and the healing. 

It’s running from the bear. The autonomic nervous system has two arms. One is sympathetic. That is made for us to run in survival mode to survive a bear attack. We should only be in that when there’s a bear, maybe once a month, we ran, we got up into the tree, and we survived or we didn’t. 

The other side of that nervous system is the parasympathetic. Guess what happens over here? Sleep, digestion, intimacy, sex, DNA repair, detox, all the things that allow the body to heal and activate its own pharmacy is over here. If you’re in stress and running from the mode, that’s going to stop that process. 

In the metabolic cancer world where I sit with those therapies, we know there are two pathways that feed cancer. One of those is sugar. That’s the ketogenic diet, all the repurposed drugs that we use, all kinds of things to block that pathway. The other is glutamate. 

Listen and just know that messages will come in the way they need. So, be aware and pay attention instead of ignoring them. Click To Tweet

We’re working on those pathways, but what’s interesting is, if the patient is in a stress response all the time, we can have them in a ketogenic state, doing the diet, doing everything that we know to do, but yet they’re still dumping glucose, their glucose is so high. Why is that? Because the body is being told, I’m in stress, I’m in alarm, I need to run from the bear, and it will pull glycogen from the muscles, even though you didn’t need it. 

It’s there, we have to have it, it’s our fuel. It’s not a bad guy, but it will pull it from the muscles and dump it in the bloodstream. The metabolic cancer therapy, researchers and those of us (doctors) that work in this, we know stress is a huge piece of this. Educating the patient in that is a big piece. 

I can do all hyperbaric oxygen, doxy. We can do all the wonderful things that we know of right now for treatments in conjunction with traditional medicine, or do them by themselves. If they’ve either been told you’re done, we’ve done everything we can do, or they say I’m not going down that path, we have to teach that stress is a big piece of getting better or not getting better.

Many Lives, Many Masters by Brian L. Weiss

Now, if you could recommend a book, or some resource that would help somebody who has fear of death, one book that I recommended and actually bought for a family member who’s dealing with cancer now, I got him Many Lives, Many Masters by Brian Weiss.

That’s right. There are so many great books out there, Joe Dispenza’s Breaking the Habit of Being Yourself and all that. But here’s the thing. It’s not really one book. By the end of my first visit with somebody where their mental and spiritual self is, I know are they at this level? Are they ready to start doing some deep breathing meditation work, like Joe Dispenza’s? Is that where I need to tell them is the next step for them? Or are they a novice? 

If they’re Born Again Christian and they say, “I can’t even listen to relaxing music because that sounds evil to me”—it’s different to them—or they say, “I could never do meditation or yoga because it goes against my religion,” I have to go down a different path with them and what I recommend. But by the end, I know the steps and I know where I can take them to get them. Maybe it’s just breathing exercises, learning to relax. Maybe it is traditional cognitive behavioral therapy, sitting on the couch and learning how to do journaling, things like that, that allow them at least a peaceful state. It’s not a one-book- or a one-treatment-fits-all ever. You’ve got to take the person where it is. 

I think one of the best examples is with music. Music can change the mood in a heartbeat for a patient. In a heartbeat. It can bring them joy, it can calm them down, non-invasive, it’s great. The studies show this and I’ve seen this just in patients with a lot of anxiety. If I tell them to go listen to this really relaxing piece of music, 60 beats per minute, it slows the heart rate down, it gets the brainwave to be more coherent, slows it down, so everything starts slowing down. If it’s too far apart, they’re up here in this land, their brain is doing this, and I asked them to listen to that deep, relaxing, slow music, they can’t take it. It makes them worse. 

Music can change the mood in a heartbeat for a patient.

Schizophrenics in a psychotic state, you cannot play relaxing music for. It makes them worse. You have to start with something upbeat that their brain can match it, and then you can start tailoring down that music to get them into a relaxed state. 

We always have to remember where the belief system is in the moment, where’s their anxiety in the moment, and tailor everything to that patient in that moment without judgment. I know what could get them better, but I may not be able to tell them that on the first visit because they’re not ready to hear it.

That makes total sense. It reminds me of what I learned from Neil Strauss about calibrating. Neil Strauss, who was the expert at picking up women. If you fail to calibrate, then you break rapport and it’s all over. Calibrating is a skill for life, for all relationships. Calibrating allows you to build that rapport and relatedness, and get them to listen, trust, and be open. 

There is one book that I’m curious about. I just learned about it. I haven’t read it yet. It’s called Reflections on the Existence of God. Do you know anything about this book? Is it something that you would recommend for somebody who is on the fence and needs some reassurance that there actually is something beyond?

Open your eyes and realize that the body is capable of infinite healing.

I haven’t read it either, so it’s hard for me to comment on, but I will tell you Neale Donald Walsch’s Conversations with God. Neale was the real deal. He is just a beautiful, wonderful person. That Conversation with God has been a bridge for those that are in Christianity, that really believe in Christianity. They want to say, God. They believe God, they don’t want to say any other words, it’s offensive to them to say spirit or anything else. 

That was a good book and it still is. Besides the Bible, I believe it is still the number one most bought book worldwide. Conversations with God allow you to say, people pray to God, but they never hear God back. Then it’s okay to think that you can get a message. It’s okay to think that God, in that sense, is the spirit that you can get messages, and that it’s all right, and it just gives permission. 

I recommend so many different things from a behavioral standpoint and a spiritual standpoint, but it’s getting to know the person sitting in front of me or on a Zoom meeting like this, getting to know them and asking questions, to understand their current belief system, and more importantly, not what they currently believe, but is it working for them? Do they feel connected? Or are they just doing it because their parents believe that?

Right, so look for the openings. Look for the openings where they might be receptive to an invitation.

They may not be ready for that message.

That’s right. It’s just like in medicine. The new doctor’s office that’s just under the insurance model. They put a plaque up that says only bring one condition today. If you have two things bothering you, you’ll have to make another appointment. Well, good grief. That’s why I’m cash paid. That’s why I spend two hours at least on the first visit because everything is connected. 

Every symptom they’re having—mental, emotional and physical—are all connected, and unless you look at the whole you can only give a bandaid. You’re pretty much turning off the fire alarm and leaving the fire going in the body until you really understand the root of what’s causing all of it. As we’re discussing today, many times that leads back to a spiritual issue—or a non-connect there is the way I’d say it. They may not be ready for that message.

I may need to help them get ready physically, get them better physically, emotionally, mentally. Then we broach the subject of the true root of the problem. You do it too early, you could lose patience. You’ve got to be willing to not judge, take them where they’re at and give them steps to breathing. 

James Nestor, which you know—James is a good friend of mine—his book, Breath. Great place to start. It’s fun to read, people get to know, hey, breathing is going to be important for me to relax and what it does to my physical body and my mental. They go, oh, I feel that. Now they’re ready, maybe to make it spiritual. The next leap is a spiritual connection.

The next leap is a spiritual connection.

Let’s talk about the book, Breath, by James Nestor. That book is a game-changing book for a lot of people. I have not read it yet, but my wife, Orion, is reading it and she’s loving it. I know that Joe Polish, a mutual friend of ours, loves that book and is raving about it and a lot of other people. I’m curious. What would be the one, two, or three biggest takeaways about that book, since you know James and you think very highly of his work?

James and I met three years ago as a thought leader. We had a big company fly us out with about four or five other people—researchers, this and that—to look at different leading-edge health technologies and things that are going on. I met James. He’d just done a documentary, divers, those that can go underneath without a tank, that can go to deep levels where nobody should be able to do that, and hold their breath for 10–12 minutes. 

That’s supposed to be impossible, but they’ve taught themselves that. He started learning about breath at that point. When he brought this book in, it was great. The three points are, if you don’t breathe correctly, it’s going to affect you mentally and physically. That’s number one. 

Breathe correctly.

Number two is how do you breathe correctly, and I’m glad that everybody gets into the book to know that, but we’re not breathing correctly from our diaphragm. I have patients I have had for 20 years. I have taught them how to breathe correctly. Not this shallow breath up in here, but using diaphragmatic breathing. Very important in pain management when I have patients with cancer pain, and morphing isn’t touching it. Guess what helps? The right type of breathing. It’s that powerful, so teaching the importance of it.

The third would be just that. Again, a reminder that the human body is capable of so much when we’re giving it what it needs, which is proper breathing, proper air and CO2, and taking out what it doesn’t need, which is detoxing all the bad things and that means things you eat, things you’re exposed to, and toxic people in your life. 

That’s not in the book, but that’s just my take. Third piece is that the basics, getting back to nature, getting back to the what are the most important things we can do to be healthy. Breathing is one of them, we forget about it. We talk about diet and exercise, but what about the right type of breathing? It’s very important.

Be precise in what you're asking for or what you're thinking about. The more accurate you are, the more specific the answers and what your body wants to do. Click To Tweet

Right. You had offered at the beginning of this episode, you talked about this breathing from the feet, and then into the heart and all that. Could we maybe try that?

Sure, we can. I will give credit. That process was brought to light by my husband, Barry Goldstein. He did it on some of my patients years and years ago, and I saw the benefit of it. I’ve just taken on my take of his technique, but I will give him credit. We can do that. We can do that right now. 

Okay, that would be amazing. Let’s do it. 

All right. First is just to take a nice deep breath. In a safe, quiet place so that they can look back at this later or listen later to try it. Here, I’ll take you through the process. Yes, we want you to be able to close your eyes and be in a peaceful place where you don’t have too many interruptions. The beauty of this is that you can do this very quickly, anywhere, at work, if you have to go to the restroom and do it in a stall, you can do it. It’s quick, it’s easy, and this is what I took that contractor through, that I talked about at the beginning. Simple, easy, but it really works. 

Breaking the Habit of Being Yourself by Dr. Joe Dispenza

First, we’re going to close our eyes and just notice our breath. Notice it going in and out. Now take a deep breath in, nice and slow. Breathe in. Hold it for a second and just let it flow out. Let it take its own time. We’re gonna do one more like that. Just breathe in. deeply and slowly and out.

Now I want you to picture that breath when I tell you, coming in through the bottom of your feet, traveling up through your legs, in your abdominal area to your heart. We’re going to breathe in through the bottom of our feet. Picture it coming in. Breathe in, breathe in all the way to the heart. Breathe out, through the heart. Breathe out through the heart. 

We’re going to do another one. Breathe in through the bottom of your feet and out through the heart, slowing the heart rate down. Another one, breathe in through the bottom of the feet and out through your heart. Now picture at the top of your head, and we’re going to take a breath in through the top of the head coming in through the head, and out through the heart. Again, breathe in through the top of the head. Breathe in that air and out through your heart.

Breath in through your head, and out through your heart. Now stay with the heart. Breathe in through your heart and out through your heart. Two more. Take your time, in through your heart, and out through your heart. Last one on your own. Now stay there. Stay in this peaceful place, no judgment. Just be for just a few seconds here. 

Open your eyes and realize that the body is capable of infinite healing, when we’re giving it love, when we’re giving it breath, and you can play off of this exercise. You can think about colors, what it feels like, you can hear sounds, you can play in different ways of doing it. By thinking about the bottom of your feet, you’re grounding yourself. 

By thinking about the top of your head, it’s allowing more of a spiritual connection or a balancing of the brain chemistry. Then when we focus on the heart, that’s allowing the heart to come to a coherent state, which means it’s the same beat, same pattern, same wavelength, it’s not chaotic. Brainwaves and heart work together. When you calm down one the other one goes with it. 

Stay in this peaceful place, no judgment.

We do a lot of brain work. A lot of people do brain work, but we forget about the heart, the heart’s rhythm. For me, it’s heart centeredness. It’s just as important, if not more important than brainwave work. When you are allowing the body to just relax and trust it to do what it knows how to do, it’s pretty amazing what it can do. 

Wow, that was fabulous. Thank you so much for taking us through that, really, really cool.

It’s better with music.

Sure, that makes sense. I didn’t even think about that.

I will say that Barry and I are about to release a guided meditation that I’ve done with him. His music is amazing. As you know, he works with all the top leaders in the field for meditation, including Joe Dispenza, and Neale Donald Walsch, and who I could keep naming, Daniel Lehmann, those people, but my guided meditation is a cellular symphony. It’s guided into visualizing, hearing, and seeing the cells in your body, going to areas for repair, and seeing it along the line of a grid. It’s a little unique, very unique. I can’t wait for us to release that and I’ll send you a copy as soon as we’re ready to release it. 

I’m looking forward to that.

I’m proud of that work. Barry’s music takes you there regardless, but mine allows the mind to have a visual to ride along there and it’s a guide. I’m pretty excited to get that launched. 

It’s comforting to know that we are all connected to the universe, Source, God, and to this beautiful energy. We just need to believe, let go, and not expect.

That’s amazing. Now, you mentioned earlier, the Conversations with God book and how you can listen, you can receive messages, not just talk to God, but have a true conversation; it goes back and forth. What would be an example of a powerful conversation you’ve had with God?

Neale hears God’s voice back. I don’t hear voices, but I get very clear messages when I’m in the state. It’s usually through different animals that I’ve associated with people that I want to connect to. My mother who has passed comes at the most profound times with little, and they’re only female. The male hummingbirds are the colorful ones. The big ones, the brown ones are the females.

It’s always a female hummingbird, and they will come right up to my face and hover, right when I’m asking for clarification or support in my life. I hear it, I feel it. My conversations are, I used to pray in a traditional sense of prayer. I still do sometimes, I do. Now, I meditate to get to the place where I’m just floating out there in this, not expecting anything. 

Breath by James Nestor

When you expect, want, or desire something to happen, that’s when it’s probably not going to happen. If you’re just allowing yourself to get to that state, where you’re in this peaceful connected to the universe, to God, to source, Buddha, whatever the belief system is, when you’re just allowing that and you’re doing a meditation process that in some cases like mine, I need to do something that gets my brain out of the way to say to me, go do Transcendental Meditation.

If I’m doing these active type meditations that work for me, and for people with very busy, active minds, that allows me to get the vagus nerve involved. There are all kinds of physical things that happened, but it allows me to all of a sudden, poof, I’m there. I was just doing my meditation work and all of a sudden, I’m there. That’s when the messages come. That’s when I know.

I also am a lucid dreamer, I always have been. When I heard many, many years ago about Edgar Cayce, I thought, oh, good, now I can talk about it. I’m not the only one. If I have a problem, something I’m concerned about—it could be biochemistry, it could be something like that—if I go to sleep at night with something on my mind that I want to work through, it’s very likely that it will be worked through in my dreams.

I have full conversations with my husband, Barry, by my side, people that I’ve been in cars with, on business trips, that they were telling me about a corporate problem, and I fell asleep because I wasn’t driving. I had a whole conversation with them, worked it out, and I was not awake. I didn’t remember that conversation, but I can also get my dreams to change. Sometimes, the alarm will go off or Barry will say, “It’s time to get up,” I said, “Wait, just a minute, I need to finish this dream.” I can go back in and I can also tailor it. If it’s going to a place I don’t want it to go, like into a scary place or something that I can literally direct my dreams. 

We all have ways that we can tap in and manipulate, we’re all different. That doesn’t mean something’s wrong with you or you’re not connected because you don’t have lucid dreaming. That’s just me. Finding what it is, maybe it’s music, maybe it’s walking in nature, maybe you have to be by water. When I’m in the shower, I get messages about water. Now I have to buy those crayons and I have to write on the shower wall, so I don’t have to jump out of the shower, dry myself off, and try to get all this great information written down. 

Listening and just knowing that your messages will come in the way they need, and just being aware and paying attention to them instead of ignoring them, oh, that intuition thing. We know that women’s brains have a bigger area that literally allows intuition than men. Sorry, but it’s true. It’s just a physical thing. But knowing that we all have those messages, call it that gut feeling or that intuition and like, “Oh, I should have listened to that,” those are all messages from wherever, whatever you believe, that they’re there if we’re open to listen to them. 

They’re there if we’re open to listening to them.

I’m very lucky to have Dr. Bill Tiller, who was one of the people interviewed on What the Bleep Do We Know!?. He was emeritus. He taught physics at Stanford, head of the department for 40 years, he’s still emeritus professor. I do a lot with energy medicine, with frequency, with cold lasers, this and that. I’ve worked in that field for a long time, and Bill was my mentor. 

Now, he will, from a science standpoint, run circles around anybody in the hard science world. Really well-done science. But he’s also one of the most spiritual people. He and his wife had meditated. We just lost Jean, his wife, but they meditated together for 60 years every day. 

What’s interesting—you’ll love this—is that they could change the pH of water. When a group of meditators would get together that were trained, and they would synchronize with one another, they would be coherent, they could change the pH of water. What does that mean? That means it’s very difficult to do. Physically, it’s very difficult to make the pH of water change, but they could do it from meditation. They found out that it didn’t have to be in the same room. It could be across the world. His real science, his real scientific instrumentation proved it. 

There's always an emotional component attached to all diseases. So, how do we address that? It's really through not being afraid of finding a spiritual connection. Click To Tweet

This is the point. They could move it, but then he said, well, I want to really be able to measure it, we should be able to make it exact, or make it move more. It was his sweet wife, that was not the sign that said, maybe when you meditate on the exact number that you want, and that’s when it moved to the exact number. This means be precise in what you’re asking, or what you’re thinking about, or what you’re contemplating, not, oh, I want to feel better. 

Be precise. The more precise you are, the more precise the answers may be and the more precise that your body may do what you’re wanting it to do, instead of just, somebody be helped me, somebody help, help me, I don’t feel good. What doesn’t feel good and why?

That precision is very important. If you ask a poor quality question of your guides or of your therapist, so it could be a spiritual guide that’s non-physical or could be your therapist you’re in their office and you ask poor quality questions, you’re going to get not the answers that you need. 

You Were Born for This by Bruce Wilkinson

Also, if you’re willing to take a risk, and put yourself out there with greater precision, a lot more benefit comes to you and to others. A great example of that, I’m in a mastermind with seven other entrepreneur guys and we’re all reading the book, You Were Born for This, together as part of that book study group/mastermind. The book You Were Born for This by Bruce Wilkinson is all about how to bring and deliver everyday miracles. Part of that is putting yourself out there.

First of all, being willing to deliver miracles. Isaiah in the book of Isaiah, he was at the feet of God, and it was like a board meeting situation up in the heavens, like, okay, I need one of you angels to go and do this, and then we got this issue here. And there’s Isaiah. He’s like, hey, here I am, send me. So if you ask, you will get. 

I do that a lot. I say, “Here I am, God, send me.” The most amazing things will show up. You got to be precise, you put yourself out there and one of the other guys in this group, he told us about how he felt nudged to offer a pretty large tip to the waitress at a restaurant that they were at with him and his family. It wasn’t just a large tip, it was a $107 tip. Not $108, not $109, $107.

He said to the woman, “How does a $107 tip sound to you?” She just started sobbing. She showed the text message from her mom that said, “I need medicine, and it’s $107. Can you pay for it?” She couldn’t. Now she could. $107, what are the odds? 

This is beautiful. This is how the universe works if you’re open to it. It’s how the universe works anyway, but you don’t see it. You get your blinders on if you believe that there’s nothing to the spiritual realm and nothing other than the tangibility of what you can taste, smell, hear, and feel.

The best healer I know connects with a source outside of yourself to give you the peace you need for the body to repair and heal. Click To Tweet

Those synchronicities we think are not. Dr. Bill Tiller always told me, all your answers are right there in front of you. They’re literally right there if you’re in the state to do it. Again, the morning is the best time and before you go to bed at night. Those are great times to be able to tap in to say, what is right in front of me, what answers are already there?

Some may come in different ways like that, you get a message and it’s $107, or somebody’s license plate says 444. That means something in that moment to you that’s a profound message. They’re all around us. There are the jokes. I’m terrible at jokes, but there was one about God sending messages. There was a flashing billboard going by it. Most people probably heard that joke, but everything that God or spirit could do to give a message was there, but couldn’t see it, and had to come in a different way. 

It’s comforting to know that we are all connected to one another, to the universe, to source, to God. We are all connected to this beautiful, beautiful energy. We just need to believe, let go, and not expect. It comes at the strangest times if you’re open. But if you really are needing something specific, that’s when you want to say, I want to be very specific in what I need help with, that precise question or precise work that you’re doing. 

The answers are right there.

I want to work on this part of my body in this area, I want to take this out, I want to take the molecules there that are going to heal it there that’s part of my body that is about. Let’s be precise with some things, but other times be open. It’s right there in front of us. The answers are right there.

So true. I’m just in awe of how miraculous, synchronous, and serendipitous life is. It seems more like a simulation than anything. It’s really wild. Now, some people are full-blown psychics. Now I understand that we are all psychic. I’m getting that, and I didn’t know that before. Even just last year, I didn’t understand that we are all psychic. 

Some people are born with a great deal of psychic ability; they just are a walk-in. Then there are others who have to do the hard yards to start to tune in, open the third eye, start getting the clairvoyance, the clairaudience or whatever, and maybe it’s just hunches or intuitive hits, but they never hear the voice that’s not theirs. Maybe it sounds like theirs. This is an interesting thing that I’ve discovered, is that it can be their sounding voice, but it’s not them. 

Conversations with God by Neale Donald Walsch

You are very well respected in the medical and science community. We just briefly touched on some of the science aspects like hyperbaric oxygen, sugar and glutamate, working with oncologists, CBT, and cold lasers. All that science stuff is also very legit.

Yes, I’m very heady. I’m a scientist, I’m a researcher. I conduct and design clinical trials. I’ve got a left brain that stores a lot of encyclopedic information about a lot of things. I’m about bringing leading edge therapies here, even if they’re not authorized yet. If they’re safe and effective, then I’m bringing some of those to people that I work with. Oncology or even professional athletes, it doesn’t matter. It’s that I love science. I love that side of it. Science and spirituality are not far apart. They’re the same and why wouldn’t you bridge the two? That’s the best medicine right there.

It’s the prescription for life, really. For a meaningful and powerful well-lived life.

It’s that prescription for health is one of the taglines. That’s the name of my supplement line and the other things, but it really is a prescription for health, and that includes lots of things, not just the supplements that I utilize. The prescription is all the above of everything that we’re talking about today. That’s the true prescription.

Reflections on the Existence of God by Richard E. Simmons III

Wonderful. Donese, this was so fun, so enlightening, inspiring, and informative. How do our listeners go to learn from you, work with you, buy your supplements, all that stuff?

I do have a website,, which you’re going to get a hold of soon to optimize it so people can find it. Right now, my patients and clients use it. The office number is 480-588-2233. I work with people from all over the world. You don’t have to be in Arizona to be a patient. 

I can do everything except the physical exam for you. Whatever I think needs to be done, I’m going to make sure your docs back home are doing it for you. I still love patient care and research, but I’m doing more education, and love the webinars, seminars, and retreats because that’s person-to-person and it’s unique to be able to work that way.

Thank you so much, Donese. Thank you listeners for being open enough to hear the whole episode and not be like, no, this is too weird for me. Because life actually is weird. It’s magical weird, though, not creepy weird. We’ll catch you in the next episode. I’m your host, Stephan Spencer signing off.

Important Links

Checklist of Actionable Takeaways

?Connect with my spirituality. My mental and physical health is affected by how at peace I am with my beliefs. Being whole helps in my healing.

?Fix the root causes of problems. The only way to overcome complications is to find the main issue. Addressing this will prevent recurrences and stop unhealthy cycles.

?Practice breathing exercises. Being mindful and focusing on my breathing calms me down and allows me to ease my anxiety. Find time to do it every day.

?Listen to relaxing music. I can easily change my mood by listening to calming music. Look for sounds with 60 beats per minute to help slow down my heartbeat.

?Be empathetic. People will easily trust me if I master how to build a rapport with them and listen to their stories. I create stronger bonds when I’m sensitive to other people’s needs.

?Detach from toxicity. Avoid unhealthy diets, environments, and relationships. I improve the quality of my life when I learn how to prioritize things that only bring positivity.

?Find quiet time to receive messages. Noise from my environment hinders my communication with God. Being still and silent will help me understand what I’m being tasked to do.

?Specify my wishes. The more precise the desires, the more chances I have of receiving them. Write a specific list of what I want to manifest into existence.

?Be willing to deliver miracles. I am merely a vessel of messages to other people and should be open to doing things out of the ordinary.

?Visit Dr. Donese Worden’s website or call her office at 480-588-2233 to get myself checked out. Follow her on Instagram and Twitter to learn more about how I can heal myself by connecting with my spirituality.

About Dr. Donese Worden

Donese Worden, NMD, is a physician, researcher, and global health educator. She bridges science and spirituality and is renowned for identifying and helping bring unique modalities and therapies from abroad to the United States, putting her on the vanguard of integrated medicine. Dr. Worden teaches courses, seminars, and retreats to educate, empower, and enlighten.

Disclaimer: The medical, fitness, psychological, mindset, lifestyle, and nutritional information provided on this website and through any materials, downloads, videos, webinars, podcasts, or emails is not intended to be a substitute for professional medical/fitness/nutritional advice, diagnoses, or treatment. Always seek the help of your physician, psychologist, psychiatrist, therapist, certified trainer, or dietitian with any questions regarding starting any new programs or treatments, or stopping any current programs or treatments. This website is for information purposes only, and the creators and editors, including Stephan Spencer, accept no liability for any injury or illness arising out of the use of the material contained herein, and make no warranty, express or implied, with respect to the contents of this website and affiliated materials.


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