AS Seen On

By: Stephan Spencer


Jeffrey Allen
“It’s easy to identify who we are and separate ourselves from others. However, outside our body, we’re pure consciousness. We’re not just all connected; we’re actually all one”
Jeffrey Allen

Imagine you have two minds: a material, analytical mind and a spirit mind or higher mind, where you feel and know things intuitively at a deeper level. When you are tuned into both minds, they work together to open up incredible possibilities in your life.

Jeffrey Allen, my guest on today’s show, lives by the philosophy that just beneath the surface of the physical world is a fun, exciting, and empowering world of energy and awareness. He has built a business coaching and training clients to awaken their spirit mind to live their best life.

In today’s episode, we talk about Jeffrey’s journey on this path, and how he has awakened his own spirit mind. We discern key differences between abundance and scarcity, and we discuss the kinds of profound shifts you can have in your life as you move from a scarcity mindset to an abundance mindset. Jeffrey shares how he has helped clients improve their relationships, deepen their spiritual connection, and increase their presence, happiness, and impact in the world. If you find the idea of bending reality intriguing, you will not want to miss this episode.

So now, without further ado, on with the show!

In this Episode

  • [01:54]Jeffrey shares how he ends up producing courses and content for Mindvalley.
  • [07:04]What is Jeffrey’s perspective on intuition and energy? In what way does he receive guidance?
  • [12:56]How does Jeffrey use telepathic communication to talk to someone’s spirit?
  • [17:11]Jeffrey talks about his experience with his guide and how it enlightened him.
  • [25:32]Are the things we experience based on our fate, or do we have a choice?
  • [29:12]As Stephan shares a couple of things he remembered from DC Cordova, Jeffrey discusses his thoughts on the two-layer reality view of our experience and how to tune in to the spirit mind.
  • [37:06]Stephan and Jeffrey discuss how connecting to your higher self and helping yourself shape reality through opportunities and guides work simultaneously.
  • [50:43]There’s no separation; consciousness flows through everything. What are the two types of awareness?
  • [53:56]Jeffrey recalls an experience he had watching the Dalai Lama on stage during a spiritual workshop.
  • [58:36]Jeffrey’s tale on asking permission for other people’s spirits.
  • [62:58]Jeffrey’s nuggets of wisdom to the listeners.

Jump to Links and Resources

Jeffrey, it’s so great to have you on the show.

Thanks, Stephan. It’s great to be here. I always love connecting with new people and new groups. It’s wonderful. Thanks.

Thank you. First of all, how did you end up producing courses and content for Mindvalley? You must have met Vishen in some synchronistic way or something.

Yeah, I did. When I found Mindvalley, I had been teaching intuition and healing work for over 10 years, but my audience was small. Even though I was traveling around the world and teaching, I could get 50 or 60 people, but it felt like I could reach many more. I wanted to help more people. I know I can help more. So I was tuning in and saying, “Okay, where’s that tribe? How do I find these people?” 

I just followed my intuition. That’s how I work. I tune in, I get information, and I follow it. Somebody referred me over to Mindvalley. I saw that they were doing this conference called Awesomeness Fest—now it’s A-Fest—and just right away, I was like, “Wow, I have to be there.”

I booked the tickets and showed up. The funny thing was my guidance was always very clear. I heard, “Go two days early.” I was like, “Okay, I don’t know why I’d go two days early, but it sounds good. I’ll go.”

I get there and meditate in the lobby, just asking, “I’m here. What do you want me to do?” My guide said, “We want you to talk to this person and offer to help. Then, we want you to go to the bar tonight and hang out there.” I was like, “I don’t drink, and I’m not really into the bar scene, but okay.” 

It's very rare for somebody to catch spiritual communication while conscious, but it's very common for people to catch it while asleep. Share on X

That’s where I met Vishen. I went over there. I was just myself, giving people little energy readings and talking about the stuff I enjoy. Pretty soon, somebody introduced me to Vishen. 

Throughout the conference, I was teaching a few classes in the hallways and teaching people how to feel the energy and tune in. By the end, Vishen said, “Hey, we’d love to work with you more if you want. We’d love to do something. I don’t know what to do, but give me a call, and we’ll set it up.”

I came in in a very easy way just by following my guidance and by being myself. I didn’t try to do anything. I didn’t go through the usual channels. 

That’s how my life goes. I find a little easy road to where I need to be.

If you hadn’t gone two days early, you wouldn’t have met Vishen in that way at the bar before the event started. Who knows if you would have even had a chance to talk to him because I presume he is pretty busy at his conference, where there are thousands of people.

That’s true. As important as meeting Vishen was the woman my guide said, “Talk to her and offer to help.” She was Tanya. She was organizing the event. I told her I do energy healing, often work different events, and help work the energy behind the scenes. 

When people are on stage, there’s so much energy moving. There’s just a lot happening. So many people are blowing up, melting down, or having a hard time behind the scenes. I said, “I can help if that’s happening. Just give me a call. I can do healing for whoever it is, get people rolling again, and be that helper behind the scenes.”

On an energy or spirit level, we're connected with everything. We're part of the whole, and we are the whole. That's why every part of the Universe can speak to us. Share on X

I probably did at least 20 energy healings during the conference for people—much Mindvalley staff. Those connections also tied into my deep feeling of family with Mindvalley. These are people I’ve not just worked with but have done healings together. We danced together. We had a deep experience together. I don’t think I could have planned any of that consciously.

Is the Mindvalley team part of your soul circle or soul family?

Definitely, there’s a sense—even when I went to the office the first time at Mindvalley—that this is part of my tribe. We are on this journey together to help people discover new parts of themselves and help people be the brightest version of themselves they want to be. We’ve definitely been doing this together. It’s not our first time around.

If that’s the case—and probably this was a soul contract that was entered into before you or them even incarnating—then it was basically inevitable for you guys to meet and work together. But still, you had the free choice not to follow your intuition and the nudges to talk to somebody, book a ticket, and arrive two days early. And all those other things needed to happen to make this a synchronistic event, a serendipitous meeting and unfolding.

What would have happened, do you think, if you hadn’t followed your intuition? Would that soul contract not have been fulfilled? Would you still have met Vishen and worked with the Mindvalley team but maybe in a less fortuitous way because you didn’t proactively follow the intuitive nudges? How does that work?

Probably. My framework for that big picture is different. I wouldn’t say that it was a contract that I had with Mindvalley. When I look at the energy, there is potential everywhere. Even though, as people, we’re individuals, I’ve got my body, skin, hair, thoughts, and everything, and it’s very easy to identify as myself and feel separate from others. When we get outside the body, that’s no longer the case. Once you’re outside the body and just pure consciousness, we’re all one. We’re not just all connected; we’re actually all one. That one is what people refer to as a higher power, God, universe, or whatever word people are enjoying in their vocabulary and life. 

There doesn’t need to be a contract. That’s thinking in body-level terms. In energy or spirit terms, there’s just huge potential. We get excited when we find potential that’s a group or a situation that will bring out our highest potential where we can do it together. 

With Mindvalley, if I hadn’t gone to that conference, I would have found them differently, or I would have found a different group with which I could also resonate. It didn’t have to be Mindvalley, but I’m sure glad it was. It turned out well. 

Things are a little more fluid than the idea of soul contracts, soulmates, etc. So it’s more fluid than we’d like to think.

Interesting. When you’re getting guidance, do you hear it as a voice in your head, maybe in your voice? Is it a knowing? Is it images or visions? Is it a combination of all the above with predominant clairvoyance that’s coming through? How does that work?

Seeing, hearing, feeling, thinking about energy, or intuition are all interpretations. That’s our conscious mind interpreting the information, but what’s coming in is just pure knowingness.

For me, it’s all of those together, but it has changed quite a bit over the years. When I first started studying intuition and energy work, clairvoyance, or seeing things, was very difficult. It’s fun now because I teach it and watch all my students go through the same thing. 

People say, “I can’t see anything.” I can relate because my teacher used to say, “Visualize an apple,” and I would think, “Well, if it’s a black apple in a dark room,” I can see it, but otherwise, I’m not getting it because I’m not seeing anything. 

What I learned was that the way we perceive information energetically doesn’t have much to do with the five senses. Instead, as we interpret that information, we tend to map it into things we can understand. 

Seeing, hearing, feeling, thinking about energy, or intuition are all interpretations. That’s our conscious mind interpreting the information, but what’s coming in is just pure knowingness. 

When I get intuition most naturally, I know it and all of it at once. It’s not linear knowing where I learned things or this thing leads to the next. I get all of it—the big picture, past, present, future, me, and everybody else. It all just comes in at once. This knowingness is so different from what I learned. It’s much different from what I’ve been teaching.

The new program I’m working on with my wife, Hisami, talks about this type of knowingness or intuition because she’s the one that introduced me to this more authentic, unfiltered, natural way of tuning in.

Normally, we process that through our five senses and try to make sense of it with our logical brain. So even if we’re trying to be all plugged in, connected, and in the zone, we’re still, for example, hearing our voice, giving the information. And then ask in our head for clarification or our next question, and then hear the response in our voice, which is weird when that happens. 

I’ve had that several times and I know plenty of people who receive information that way. On the other hand, there are times when I’ll hear the voice in the person’s voice. I’ll ask Gandhi, for example, something, and I’ll listen to his voice instead of my own voice, or I’ll get a vision. 

Sometimes, it’s my third eye or third eye visor seeing that image. Then, rarely but sometimes, it comes in visually in a very ultra-high-definition virtual reality way. If my eyes are closed, and I’m experiencing that, if I open my eyes, the overlay of that ultra-high-definition vision is not an afterimage or inverted colors. It’s the correct colors. The background of what’s in my room when I open my eyes is there, and then the image of the vision slowly fades away. 

That is pretty freaky. That only happened several times, but I love it when that happens. Has that happened to you?

That’s fantastic. All the ways you’ve mentioned are wonderful. What I like about what you’re saying is that you’re just letting these experiences happen. The main thing people need to do or not do to get intuition is not to be worried about outcomes. 

Clairaudience is one of my strongest traits. I can just say hello to a guide or talk telepathically to my friends.

Clairaudience is one of my strongest traits. I can just say hello to a guide or talk telepathically to my friends. For example, I spoke to Vishen telepathically before working at Mindvalley. 

You called him over telepathically, and then he came over.

Actually, in the morning, once I’d come back from the festival, I woke up and I was meditating. My guides said, “Hey, we want you to reach out to Vishen today and sign up as an author.” I don’t remember the exact words. I was like, “Okay.” They said, “You need to contact him within the next hour.” 

But I don’t have any contact information for him, so I thought, “Okay, I’ll just look at the energy.” So I just tuned in and said hello to him telepathically. I just said, “I’m going to contact you. What’s the easiest way to connect with you?” 

He gave me three things. He started from a conversation we had. I remember who you are because I meet a lot of people. Just get to the point and make it short. You don’t have to butter me up or anything. I can’t remember the third one, but I did those things and reached out to him. He responded within five minutes and said, “Hey, looks great. I think we’ve had our new author,” and then he sent me to their authoring department.

I do that a lot. I use telepathic communication to understand the context I’m going into. That’s one reason we have conversations; it feels like it’s happened before. Before this, I was sitting down, getting ready to talk to you, Stephan, and I did the same thing. I just said hello telepathically, chatted a little bit, and got a little energy flowing. Then, when I see you in person, I feel really comfortable. It’s like, oh, there’s my old friend that I just talked to, even though I’ve never seen you in person before. It’s really wonderful.

That’s awesome. I didn’t sense that you communicated with me telepathically. Was that my higher self that you are communicating with or what some people refer to as the light avatar or oversoul, or was it my soul tethered to my body that picked up on it, but I just consciously wasn’t aware of it?

How we perceive information energetically doesn’t have much to do with the five senses. As we interpret information, we tend to map it into what we can understand.

When I say you—that’s a great question—I’m just talking about your spirit, not your conscious personality. What I’ve found—it’s pretty fascinating—doing this over the years is that it’s very rare for somebody to catch that communication consciously. It only happened a few times, but it’s common for people to catch it unconsciously. So I can have a conversation with somebody very specific, and then with that person—when I see them a few minutes later—the same conversation will play out, they’ll suggest the things that I’d said beforehand, and so on. 

It’s really fun. For me, it’s just a way of flowing better. It’s like taking a little peek at the future and getting in sync with somebody. It’s not a way to steer things or manipulate the world. It’s just a way to be in the flow more gently.

Amazing. Are you getting special intel to help you overcome barriers or obstacles in this process? Let’s say that it wasn’t just with Vishen on how to rise above the noise because he gets a lot of pitches and inquiries, but this is how I need you to get around the red tape, backlog, or whatever. Does that happen a lot, or is that rare?

That happens all the time, and it’s just an ongoing thing. I don’t know if it’s just my personality, but I’m probably oblivious to all the red tape and all the things that could get in the way. I don’t really notice them, so I tend to go where I’m going anyway. 

It’s fun, but I get very specific guidance. I’ll give you a couple of examples. Before I got into energy work full-time, I was a software engineer. I had a 15-year career writing software and was very successful at it. It was fun, but at some point, I decided that I wanted to take my hobby, which is energy work and intuition, give it a try, and see if I could do this full-time.

Every experience is an opportunity. The future is just a huge probability space we're crystallizing into what we call the present. The more we try or work hard to plan and create the future, the more challenging life becomes. Share on X

I was living in Sedona at the time. I wanted to buy a car to go out and visit my teacher in Mount Shasta, but I was also trying to save money. So anyway, to make the long story short, I woke up one morning, and my guide said, “Okay, we want you to drive around. You can find the car you want today.” 

We’re talking about a Prius. I’d called around before, and there were none anywhere available. Back when they were super hot, you couldn’t get your hands on them, but that day, I found two at a dealer about an hour away. 

I drove to the dealer. By the time I get through, there’s a third one. The whole time, my guide is just saying, “Buy the car,” and I’m thinking, “I don’t want to buy a new car. I don’t want to spend that kind of money.” They’re saying, “Don’t worry about the money, buy the car.” I was like, “Okay, I can play that game. Which one do I buy, the base model or the top-of-the-line?” My guide said, “Well, which one do you want?” I was like, “Of course, I want the top-of-the-line.” My guide said, “Buy that one.”

I bought the car, financed the whole thing, and drove home. Then, the next morning, I’m meditating. I tune in and say, “I need a little more information about this. Don’t worry about the money because it feels like I have a huge car payment and loan right now, which I don’t want. Please give me a little more information. “

My guidance comes in. My guidance is actually not my voice, which is interesting. It’s in a different voice. Let’s just put it that way. My guide was very clear. It said, “Here’s what’s going to happen. You’ll get laid off in two weeks from your job, and since you’re working half-time right now, you’ll get a half-time severance package. So we want you to call your boss and move up to full-time so you can get the full-time severance package because you worked there 10 years full-time, and you deserve it.”

The way the world works is not how we think it works.

I thought, interesting, I didn’t know I would get laid off. I didn’t know any of that. So I sent a little email to my boss and said, “Hey, could I go full-time for a little bit to pay off this car I just bought?” 

I don’t want to stay there. I just want to work enough to pay off the car and return to half-time. I was a little nervous about it. She emailed back immediately and said, “Okay, I’m making the change.” I called her and was like, “Wait, I’m not sure. Let me think about it.” She’s like, “Jeff, let me make this change.” I was like, “Okay.”

I hung up. Sure enough, two weeks later, she called, and I was laid off, which was fantastic. I was ready to go. The difference in my severance was exactly within $100 of the price of the car. So I took that extra severance and paid the entire car off. 

This is just one example, but these things happen regularly to me because I’m tuning in, listening not with my mind but to this source of infinite information that we all have, and just feeling those possibilities. My guides bought me a new car. It’s an unusual experience, but it’s fairly common for me. This happened just over and over.

Amazing. I’ve come to realize that you get this guidance not just through your inner knowing, hearing, inner voice, and all that, but you get it in the environment too. 

I have a conversation with somebody, I’ll be sitting outside in the backyard, and there’s this beautiful lake—Enchanted Lake is what it’s called. It’s right on our property. We live on the borders of this beautiful lake. 

Nature is really good because our mind tends to relax, so the information comes in easily.

There are fish that will “randomly” jump out of the water, but it’s not random. It often happens when I’m saying something important to someone or receiving something important in the conversation. It’s like an underline to what’s being said. 

I’ll also get certain birds or animals showing up at a certain moment. That will be further information. It’s like getting angel numbers but in the form of the animal kingdom. You’re getting additional data to utilize that supports, augments, or adds to what I’m receiving internally. That may happen to you too.

That’s great. I think we’re all receiving information like this all the time. On an energy level or spirit level, we’re connected with everything. We’re part of the whole, or we are the whole. Everything can speak to us. As you said, nature is really good because our mind tends to relax, so the information comes in easily. 

I’ll tell the stories about this clear communication to give those people an idea of what’s possible, not to set the expectations that anybody should do it that way. Even though that’s happened a lot for me, it’s more common what you described, Stephan, where I’m going about my day and being gently guided or nudged here and there. Sometimes, I don’t even know why or what the reasoning is. I feel like going over there, so I go over there. I don’t know why, but I’m doing things differently today. 

It’s easy to look back and say, “Oh, that thing I did differently led me to this amazing opportunity,” or “Oh, wow, that was the guidance I was getting even though I didn’t realize it at the time.” It’s great. When you let yourself be open to the possibility that you’re always being guided essentially by your higher self, life can be very easy. Even the hard times can be easy because you know you’re supported.

Things do happen for a reason, and nothing is random. Somebody more of a materialist will hear this and think, that’s silly. A fish jumping out of the water in perfect time to something that you’re saying or hearing or a bird flying in the right at the moment to tell you that you should look up that bird’s totem definition, the Power Animals book, or whatever seems like a big stretch to me. All of the reality bends to your needs and wishes. I don’t know. I can’t buy into it, somebody might say.

The way I make sense of it is that the universe is essentially a holographic projection. All of it is a movie edited by ourselves in real-time. Our angels, of course, assist us in this. So when things suddenly show up out of nowhere, and I was like, what are the odds of that happening, it’s written into the script of the holographic movie, and you’re in the Holodeck of Star Trek: Enterprise

That’s how I make sense of it, but I’d like to hear your take on this.

It’s a big question. People often wonder about this. What you’re getting at is, is it fate and everything is predetermined, or do we have a choice? How does that all play out? 

For me, everything is an opportunity. The future is just this huge probability space that, as we live, we’re crystallizing into what we call the present-time experience. The more we try or work hard to plan and create this experience, the more challenging life is. 

You can be successful that way. You can make things happen, but I’ve found that I can reach the same success or happiness by letting things happen. I still have to take action, but I leave the planning up to my higher self, and then I leave the action in my body, following through on the guidance I get and stepping into the opportunity to stay there. 

It’s really fascinating. The way that the world works is not how we think it works. It’s very hard to understand it with our intellectual mind because we’re dealing with two different types of accounting. Our intellectual or immaterial mind is used to objects and physical things, even basic accounting, like if I’ve got five apples and I give you one, now, I’ve only got four.

Now, we’re getting a lot of energy awareness by using the Internet and digital things rather than physical things.

Our logical mind thinks about physical objects, but energy has nothing to do with that. It’s a whole different accounting system. Now, we’re getting a lot of energy awareness by using the Internet and digital things rather than physical things. 

A good example is CDs. There are 10 CDs, somebody buys 1, and now there are 9 left on the shelf. So every time somebody takes one, there’s one less. 

We’ve been out of that for a long time. Now, when you go online, find a song, and take one, there’s one more copy. You didn’t deplete a store of copies. There weren’t 10 there, and now there’s 1 missing. There’s one more now. Every time somebody takes one, there’s one more.

This is energy accounting. The difference between abundance and scarcity is basically which model you operate in the physical or energetic world. It’s fun because even money stopped being a physical commodity nearly 50 years ago in the US. It’s not an object moving around. It’s just energy. That’s why this concept of scarcity, where if I take money, I’m taking it from somebody, or if other people have a lot, there’s not enough for me, isn’t true. This would only be true if we were handing rocks or coins around, but we stopped doing that 50 years ago. It’s just numbers. Every time you get more money, there’s more money to have energetically. 

It’s switching the mindsets when people can switch out of this mental accounting of objects. It’s an understanding of energy awareness. That’s when things open up because you’re not competing for scarce resources energetically in your love life, finances, etc. You realize there really is abundance but in a much different way than most people would describe it.

It reminds me of a couple of things. One is a phrase that I learned from DC Cordova, the lady who runs Money & You seminars. This was relatively early on in the pandemic. A lot of restaurants were closing permanently, and a lot of businesses were going out of business. 

The difference between abundance and scarcity is basically which model you operate in the physical or energetic world.

She reminded the group. This was an alumni call of people who attended Money & You. I was on that call, and she’s like, the money has not left the planet. That’s true at the physical level; money hasn’t left the planet. The money that changed hands went from some companies that went out of business, the ones that were able to buy at great prices these different businesses, assets, and so forth. So the money didn’t leave the planet in that physical way, but also in a metaphysical or spiritual energetic way, it didn’t leave the planet either. As you say, it can multiply. That’s one thing. 

The other is that, essentially, you’re operating on two levels or layers of reality superimposed. Okay, I need to make a money transfer and pay my bill, but I also know and trust that more money will show up. If I make a big donation, something that makes me uncomfortable because it’s such a large amount of money, I know and trust that that money will get replaced because one of the things guaranteed in the Bible is you’re going to tithe. So the money will come back to you, which is incredible. It works. God said you could test me on this. 

I’d like your thoughts on that two-layer reality view of our experience and how that might also play out in other ways beyond money, physical transfer of assets, transactions, and things.

There are two layers like you said, or two ways to understand. As you’re talking, I was thinking about what happened with money in the last couple of years during COVID. Indeed, the money didn’t leave the planet. What changed was it wasn’t flowing as much. Like our communication, friendships, and everything, there was less communication, less opportunity to connect, and less money flowing or being spent. This is what the economy is actually about. It’s not about the quantity. It’s about the flow. 

Again, it’s about energy. If I had a $100 bill, I put it in the bank, and at the end of the month, I pulled it out, I still have $100, but it didn’t do anything. It was inactive. It didn’t accomplish anything during that month. 

I can take that same $100, go to the grocery store, buy some food, the person at the grocery store pays their employees, the employee goes and gets a massage, and then that person who got a massage goes and washes their car and gets their car clean. That money goes from place to place to place. At the end of the month, that $100 has created thousands of dollars worth of transactions and exchanges, and the $100 is still there. 

When you look at the energy, the quantity doesn’t matter. It’s the flow that matters.

When you look at the energy, the quantity doesn’t matter. It’s the flow that matters. What changed in COVID is it wasn’t flowing as much. That’s why the government understands the economy on this level. That’s why the government started spending money and making it flow through these weird artificial ways like giving everybody money. Who knew the government could give everyone money? That’s weird, but that’s what’s happening energetically. 

To your bigger question about these two different ways of seeing things, my best description comes from my wife, Hisami. She sees energy in a much more profound way than I see energy. I’m a normal person or engineer that learned about intuition and energy work because it was fun and interesting. But, in some ways, I may want to be able to control my life. So I thought this would help, which is now kind of funny.

My wife, Hisami, always saw energy from the time she was a child. She never had this sense of separation from the source. She was always connected with everything and understood what was coming in the future for everybody. When she met people, she knew what was happening. It blows me away to a completely different level of awareness. 

For the last five years, I’ve spent much time with an interpreter. My wife doesn’t speak English fluently, and I don’t speak Japanese fluently even though we’ve been married for 12 years, so we have had an interpreter for the last 5 years to learn about this perspective. So it’s getting what you were talking about. 

She said the best way to describe it is like imagining you have two minds. You have this material mind whose job it is to do things in the material world. It’s wonderful. We need that analytical mind. It’s also where emotions are in that mind.

She said, but you also have another energy that you’re using that we could call a mind. She calls it the spirit mind. This one is that extra layer you’re mentioning. When you’re in that space and connecting with a spiritual mind, you know everything not intellectually but on a holistic level. So if you move naturally through life and connect with a spiritual mind, you will walk into the most beautiful opportunities for healing, creating things, and helping others without any apparent planning. 

If you move naturally through life and connect with the spiritual mind, you will walk into the most beautiful, unplanned opportunities for healing, creating, and helping others. Share on X

When she was telling me this, I could see that that’s when my life made these huge, amazing changes. So I’ve always been in that state of listening and following, not planning and trying. Although, of course, I do a lot of planning and trying to, it’s the spirit mind that is the one that gets me connected and gets me flowing and able to be my brightest self and to help people. 

The way to tune in and find that is just knowing that it exists and then starting to work on letting go of the attachment. We have to see how good and amazing our analytical mind is. Learning to say, that’s great. I am so happy I have this analytical mind. Still, I don’t have to listen to it all the time because, to be honest, a lot of times, it’s just making stuff up, obsessing about details, and doing a lot of unnecessary things because oftentimes, it’s not grounded and connected to this spirit mind. Things are the most amazing for me when you have them and work together. 

This is an abstract answer, but that’s my best take on those two layers. I would call them two minds.

I love that. I think the distinction I get about this or the way I process or make sense of it is not only am I tuning in to my higher self, guides, angels, or God himself, but I’m also helping to shape my reality and co-create it. 

The vision or visual I get with that is like in the movie Minority Report. Tom Cruise is swiping midair with his hands to open and close windows, just displaying midair, zooming in and out, rewinding things, and so forth. Have you seen that movie?


So you understand my visual. You can do that with your energy and the energy of. I want to zoom in and materialize from the vortex of my desire for the house of my dreams. I want to double-click on it, zoom in, and get granular about what I want. If I want to have animals on the property, how many? What are they? If I’m going to have chickens, how many chickens? Where are they going to be, et cetera? 

Making that not just an idea or a theory but very tangibly real in your imagination and energy field is part of the process of doing this effectively. And not just tune in and let your guides and your higher self take you wherever they want you to go. So there’s that being carried down the river aspect to it. Rather than trying to swim it on your own, there’s also that part of effortlessly helping architect your ideal future. Is that accurate?

We’re doing both. We can definitely listen to or read the Book of Life, but it’s written in pencil, so we can also edit, make changes, write in the book, and co-create what’s happening in our lives. It’s really powerful. 

We can definitely listen to or read the Book of Life, but it’s written in pencil, so we can also edit, make changes, write in the book, and co-create what’s happening in our lives.

I liked the description you had of the Minority Report because, for me, when I do energy work, it always looks like that. The person who made that in the movie probably does something similar, but it’s very common. If I’m working on a project, I’ll have my hands working on the energy and spinning things up. I might move some energy here or bring something new in. It looks like I’m physically assembling something or working on things, but there are no physical things. I’m just working on my energy. It’s very powerful. You can definitely create and manifest this way. 

It’s interesting, though. As we mature along our life path, we tend to focus more on our lower chakra needs at the beginning. We focus more on do we have money, food, or shelter. Then, in the second chakra, do I have a good relationship? Do I have a fun sex life? Then, the third chakra is, do I have control over my life where I can make things happen or manifest things?

These are all wonderful. We want to engage, enjoy, and master all these different energies, but at some point, once we feel confident that these things are possible, it becomes less interesting to do them. 

I could sit down and manifest things that are crazy just because I’ve got so much experience doing it, but I don’t do that anymore. It’s just not interesting to me to live that way. It’s shocking for people coming in as students go, but I’m learning about energy work because I want to create more money or wealth or write my own story. 

I’m like, I get it because that’s why I got into it too, but eventually, it’s just a natural progression to realize I’m pretty cool with whatever happens. If I write everything in my book, I can only get what I can imagine. When I stop doing that, I can create a life better than I can imagine. I can live beyond my dreams. 

The best example I have is my relationship with Hisami. Most people create relationships more energetically. It’s one place where we do well. I’d been single for about 10 years and wanted to be married again, but I hadn’t made it happen. So I wanted to make it happen, working on energy and everything. 

Finally, I gave up and said, “Hey, guides or God, I need help.” If I knew what I was doing and how to manifest the relationship that I wanted to be in, I would have done it already. But I don’t know how to create what will make me happy even though I’m trying, and I’m good at creating things. So I don’t know what’s going to make me happy. 

As we mature along our life path, we tend to focus more on our lower chakra needs at the beginning.

Once I gave up and started following, I met my wife, Hisami. Of course, my material or analytical mind still couldn’t quite accept it. But I knew in my heart that this was the woman I wanted to be with. This is the most fascinating person I’ve ever met—everything I can imagine. But then, a whole bunch of things I didn’t even know were possible. 

It just blew me away. My mind is saying, “Yeah, but she lives in Japan. She speaks Japanese and not English. You live in the US, and you don’t speak any Japanese. How’s that going to work?” I’m like, “I don’t know, but I also don’t care.” I know there’s a brighter and more exciting opportunity than any other. That train is leaving the station, and I’m getting on it. I don’t even care what’s going to change. 

That crazy move is the kind of move that, for me, always defies logic. People tell me they’re crazy, but when I look back, everybody’s trying to create the same thing. Everybody’s trying to find those experiences, but they’re trying to plan them. You can’t. As I said, you can’t be the planner if you want to live a life beyond your dreams or better than you can imagine. 

Where do you and your wife live now? Are you guys together in the same location, or do you have to do long-distance marriage for the time being?

No, we’re in Tokyo. I thought she would move to Sedona when we first married, but that was just miscommunication. At some point, I realized she was not coming here, so I would live in Japan. 

We’ve been married for 12 years now. It’s fascinating. I think it helped in some ways when we first met that we didn’t speak the same language. Because if you want to connect with and get to know somebody, if you spend an hour or an evening with them and don’t talk if it’s somebody that you want to connect with, you’re not going to be on your phone or doing something else. You’re just trying to connect with this person. If they can’t talk, amazing things happen. Things open up amazingly. Best date ever.

Amazing. I have a fun story. My listeners have probably heard it a few times already, but I wanted to share it with you, Jeffrey, since you had an amazing surrender and meeting with your soulmate that happened shortly thereafter. 

Something like that happened to my wife, Orion and me. We met at a Tony Robbins event called Date With Destiny. It was the last day of the event after it finished in the wee hours of the night at 1 AM or 2 AM in the lobby. 

Earlier that day, I prayed for her to show up. First, I wrote up a relationship vision of who I would be in the relationship, who I wanted in my ideal relationship, and how that relationship would be. Then I prayed to God for her to show up right away. 

Before that, I was using all sorts of tricks, hacks, and stuff to try and get this amazing soulmate. I learned pickups. I had gotten divorced three years prior, and I was hopeless at attracting women that I needed to go through a whole physical transformation, learn some social skills, and so forth. 

I was a hot mess for a while. I didn’t have a single date for 2 ½ years. I learned pickup and was using techniques and stuff that I had learned from Neil Strauss. Finally, I was getting some results, but it wasn’t until I surrendered and let go and let God that instantly, 12 hours later, we were introduced by a mutual friend. By the way, nine days later, I proposed to her in a hot air balloon.

There’s no distance between us physically or in time. Time and space are a material world construct, but energetically, we’re everywhere.

That’s great. How did it compare with your list?

Absolutely everything on the list. There were probably 40 things on the list. The only thing that stands out that I forgot to put on the list but I wanted, was exotic. She’s a Middle Eastern Israeli and looks exotic and incredibly beautiful. Unfortunately, I forgot to write exotic down.

You got to go beyond what you’re envisioning even though you’re envisioning very clearly. This ‘letting go’ process is when things open up. It sounds like you’ve probably had a similar experience to me. For a long time—probably the first two years we were married—when I woke up in the morning, opened my eyes, and looked over at my wife, Hisami, laying there, I felt disbelief. I can’t believe that there’s a person this amazing and that she’s my wife. What happened? This is amazing. It’s wonderful.

The thing about winning the lottery is that we can all win the lottery. The game is rigged in our favor. That’s incredible.

I’ll circle back on that thought around there being two layers of reality superimposed. There’s one layer that I’m experiencing and living in the moment, doing what my guidance tells me, being benevolent, revealing light, reining in my reactivity, and all that good stuff.

Then, there’s a layer on top of that that I’m trying to live with now. It’s a lot harder. That is the recognition that it’s just God and me, and everything is an illusion except for love. The suffering, heartache, failures, trials and tribulations, disconnections, and everything is an illusion, and it’s just God and me. 

Suppose I operate on both of these levels or layers of reality at the same time. In that case, I tend to get the most benevolent outcomes in the most amazing ways that I can’t even envision, but it’s hard to have that dual awareness and to say, “Okay, I’m stopping to talk to this homeless person, give them money, and find out what their name is.” If I see that person again, remembering that person’s name and saying it back to them is one level or layer, and then there’s this other layer that it’s all God. It’s pretty trippy.

That’s great. You described it really well. There are two awarenesses. In the body, we operate with our material mind that works, takes action, thinks, analyzes, has motions, and so on. Our spirit mind is just what you described. It could go further. You said it’s just God and me. You could say, it’s just me, God, but our ego doesn’t want to get that big. We don’t want to go there. 

Consciousness flows through everything.

What you’re saying is that there’s just one consciousness. Bodies are plural; consciousness is singular. There’s just consciousness. Consciousness flows through everything. When it’s flowing through a particular body, it looks like Jeffrey Allen’s personality is flowing through a different body. It seems like your personality, but there isn’t another consciousness out there. You can hear this sometimes in other sayings. People say there’s only one of us here. I really like that. That’s a nice way to say it.

Traditionally, says In Lak’ech in one of the Native American dialects, which means I am another you. All the great spiritual teachings of the world are trying to get at this particular thing that is very hard to describe. Even though it’s true that we are separate physically, there isn’t any separation at a consciousness level. 

I like what you said. You need to have both of these awarenesses. You can’t just say, “oh, suffering is not happening. I’m just going to pretend it’s not happening.” It is happening, but it’s not at the point where I’m tuned into this other level. Suffering is happening here on this physical plane because we have this idea of separation, which drives competition, egos, and everything. It’s necessary to live here, but in the bigger picture, from life to life, there’s just consciousness, and it’s permeating us, everything around us—the animals, plants, planets, and stars. There’s just consciousness or God.

Are you familiar with the short story, The Egg, by Andy Weir?

No, I’m not.

It’s a short read. But we’re all the bakers at the bakery. We’re the homeless person on the side of the road. We’re checking you out at the grocery store, etc. So we’re all experiencing every aspect of life over and over until we’ve had enough lifetimes. 

It’s the rudimentary explanation of that short story, but it’s really beautiful. I’d recommend you take a look at it. It only takes a few minutes to read.

That’s great. That teaching is out there all over. I watched the Dalai Lama on stage in Los Angeles many years ago. He had 108 monks on stage. It was teaching. It was all Tibetan, and there were probably a couple of thousand people. There’s this huge auditorium, and everybody fell asleep the whole time. It was a three-day event. 

My friends who came with me drove out from California to go there. By noon the first day, they’re like, “Okay, I’m out of here. I’m going to the beach. I can’t stay awake. This is super boring,” but energetically, I was like, it’s not boring. 

What’s happening is we’re each getting a massive healing and alignment energetically by being in the presence of this coherent person and 108 monks that are all super coherent. We’re lining up and can’t stay awake because we’re just not used to operating at this level.

I hung in there. I was there the whole time, but at one point, I tuned into the Dalai Lama and said, “Hello, can you give me the cliff notes and just sum it up for me because I don’t understand Tibetan, but I love it?” He said, “Okay, I can just sum it up for you. We’re all one.” That’s all I’m talking about. It will take me three days to say it in many different ways for us to get it, but that’s all I’m talking about. 

I had the takeaway. The next weekend, I was at another spiritual workshop. I was a big junkie and would go to every spiritual workshop. I was sitting in the class—I’d been in this one before—and I thought, I’m going to try out this we’re all one thing experientially because knowledge is interesting, but I need experiences to know it’s true for me. 

We’re meditating, and I thought, “Okay, we’re going to circle here. I’m going to see if I can move my consciousness. So if we’re all one, that means I’m also the person sitting next to me.” 

I just moved my consciousness over into her body, which was fascinating. I could hear thoughts playing by, and it was me, but it wasn’t the me I was used to. I was still identifying as me, but my name was now Chris, and I could see the teacher from a slightly different angle. 

I was like, wow, that’s blown me away. So then, I said, “Can I get in all 12 people here?” Sure enough, I was expanded, so I was feeling everybody’s consciousness, I could see the teacher from slightly different angles, and all of it felt like me. None of it felt like somebody else, even though they were different. 

I wanted to play a little further, so I was like, okay, we’re all on the same page here, so this seems easy. Can I expand my consciousness to somebody who is not in this group? Pretty soon, I’m outside walking down the street in somebody’s awareness and body by the hotel. I have completely different thoughts. 

All of these were happening simultaneously, and it was also me, me, that was in this body. It’s fascinating. But what was interesting about it for me is that now, I have an experience rather than an idea, so I don’t need to put words around it, I don’t need to write a book about it, and I don’t need to go further to understand it because I had an experience. I understand because I had an experience. I don’t need to intellectualize it. 

When I talk about my ideas or philosophies, they’re all tested experiences I lived.

When I talk about my ideas or philosophies, it’s not just ideas I had or thought about. For me, they’re all tested experiences that I lived because, to be honest, if you don’t do that, if you don’t test out what you hear and live it yourself, you don’t know if you’re making stuff up or somebody else made it up. So I encourage everybody to explore and try these crazy things for themselves. 

It doesn’t matter what I did, what I heard, or anybody else’s results. It just matters what you’re doing for yourself and what experiences you have because when you have an experience, that’s when you understand, even if you can’t explain it to anybody. So the path I always recommend is spirituality is experiential, not academic.

I learned from the monks in India when I first awakened in 2012 that God is an experience. The divine is an experience, not a belief. It’s really powerful.

Did you have to get permission from the souls of the people that you are occupying their bodies temporarily, or did you do it without permission?

There’s only one of us here, so who would I ask for permission? That question comes from this analytical mind; it’s pretending we’re separate. I wasn’t operating in that space; I didn’t get a signed waiver from them. So it’s not really necessary.

I get mentoring from Tina Zion, an amazing medical intuitive, Reiki master, and psychic. She always told me to ask permission before doing remote healing on somebody. I can go ahead and pray for somebody, and then their higher self can reject it if they don’t want the healing. Still, you got permission to go into somebody’s field, do some energetic healing on them, and remove a negative entity or something attached to somebody. She hammered that into me.

Sure. When I teach energy healing, I say, oh, you want to get people’s permission, but permission can also be energetic. The important part about permission is not what people think. It’s not about the other person. It’s not about consent, even though that’s important in the physical realm. What it’s about is understanding your role as a healer. Asking permission puts me in the mindset or framework that I’m offering something, but it’s okay if the other person doesn’t want it. It’s okay if, even though I think they need healing, they don’t feel that way. It’s okay if I offer them ten things and they say I only want one thing or I don’t want any. That’s totally okay.

Permission is great, but what’s happening energetically is not what people think. So it’s not about the other person’s consent or violating that other person because that violation is happening when you’re thinking better than them about what they need. 

What if I step into situations and say, “Oh, wow, that person’s in pain?” I will help them and start doing some energy work on them. That’s the violation right there. But if I have a different mindset, asking for permission changes that mindset too, “Oh, I care about that person,” or “I feel love for that person even though I don’t know them.” I want to help, so I’m going to ask them for permission which switches my energy field to an offer rather than a doing.

I’m not the person fixing this for that person that needs me. Rather, I’m a conduit for energy and love to come through. If they can receive that in a way that helps them, that’s wonderful. 

Power Animals by Steven D. Farmer

Permission is really important, but it’s not over here. Don’t think about it in physical terms. It’s okay to think about it in physical terms, but that’s not the important part. It’s a cleverly worded structure to get people to align energetically. Pretty much anything you talk about, energy work or spirituality, people get stuck on the words, processes, procedures, and information about it, which is unimportant. Those are just clever tricks somebody wrote down to help unconscious people line up because we’re all unconscious, so we need those little tricks.

Yeah. We’re on autopilot. Awesome. I appreciate you sharing all your wisdom, experience, and energy over this last hour. If you wanted to share one last parting few words of wisdom that we haven’t already discussed, I’m curious what that would be.

I tune into the audience and say hello. The people listening are just really beautiful, authentic people. I feel such a nice energy there and an authentic desire from the audience to be a brighter you. You can even say be your highest self which sounds a little bit like I or self, and embody your spirit. 

But I also see pain there, this struggle that people feel like I’m not there yet. I’m here. I want to be here and be this amazing person I know I can be, but right now, I’m here. For different people, that’s just tuning in for different energies. For some people, that’s a relationship. I want this relationship but don’t have it, I want this career but don’t have it, or I want this to help people, but I don’t have it. It’s just this comparison. 

It doesn’t have to be a painful thing. I would encourage anybody listening now that when you feel that, when you feel like I’m not enough yet, I feel a little disappointed, sad, embarrassed, or whatever, or that I’m not to the place I think I can be, remember that that just means you’re growing. You’re aware that there’s more, and you’re leaning into it, so of course, you feel a little bit inadequate compared to who you want to be. That’s normal. 

Every year at New Year, I meditate and reflect on who I was a year ago and what I was thinking. What was the most interesting thing for me? Without fail, every year, I laugh a little bit at who I was a year ago. I feel embarrassed. I can’t believe I thought those things were important. 

With love, I look back and chuckle at myself, but I also recognize that I’ll be doing that again next year, looking back at me right now.

If you’re growing and learning, you always have the experience to look back and laugh at yourself or to look ahead and say, well, I don’t measure up to who I’m turning into. But, of course, you don’t. You’re growing. This is not something to feel bad about. This is something to be excited about, excited that you’re feeling more potential for yourself. You’ll never get to that place because you’re always dreaming a new dream. You’re always expanding. 

Give yourself a break now and enjoy that process instead of beating yourself up or feeling like you’re not enough in some way because it’s not true. You are amazing, much brighter, and more beautiful than you could imagine.

Wow. I was just so struck by the beginning of your Mindvalley course on duality when you tuned in to your tribe of students who weren’t just at that moment taking the course but who were in the future taking the course. Getting all of us together energetically to communicate, wish each other well, and send love across all time, space, and dimensions. 

You were able to do that just now. So everybody who’s listening across all time, space, and dimension, whether it’s the podcast audio only, the video on YouTube, or the written transcript, at any point in time you’re experiencing this episode or interview, you are tapping into them and feeling out where they’re at and what they’re struggling with. That’s amazing.

There’s no distance between us physically or time-wise. Time and space are a material world construct, but energetically, we’re everywhere. You think of the moon as separate and far away. The sun is a little further away, but the universe isn’t far away. We’re inside it. It’s not far. You can’t get anywhere else. There’s nowhere else to be. 

We’re all tuned in that way all the time. So it’s just letting the noise turned down, and that signal turns up.

Very cool. Thank you so much, Jeffrey, and thank you, listener. I love all of you. If you can spread that love to others in your energy, not just in your words and deeds, you’ll have an incredible ripple effect that spans lifetimes. 

I wish you well, and we’ll catch you in the next episode. I’m your host, Stephan Spencer, signing off.

Important Links

Checklist of Actionable Takeaways

?Remain more in tune with my intuition. Elevate my awareness tol help me make decisions quickly and adapt to rapidly-changing conditions. When a decision is right, it will feel clear, nourishing and enriching.

?Develop the ability to discern where I should focus my attention. Imagine a magnet behind my eyes, attracting all of my internal energy. Refocus my attention from places, people and events: this will calm, clear, and focus my mind.

?Let my creative energy flow freely. Visualize this energy flowing through my body and out of my palms. Stretch my hands open, then relax to increase the flow.

?Stay powerfully present. Reconnect my body with the Earth to quickly recover a peaceful, powerful presence. Imagine a tree trunk extending from my hips deep into the Earth. As a root, let myself connect to the center of the Earth.

?Create room to breathe. Visualize my aura and focus my energy on my intentions. This helps me create personal boundaries to remain comfortable with my energy.

?Listen to the source of infinite information rather than my own mind. Allow my higher self, angels, and guides to lead me to infinite possibilities and create an easier life.

?Take action but allow my higher self to plan my life. By allowing this guidance, I can achieve my desired success and happiness as I step into the Universe’s opportunities.

?Experience spirituality. The path to consciousness is true spirituality and brings deep understanding – even when I can’t explain it.

?Cultivate a growth mindset. When I feel disappointed, embarrassed, sad, or inadequate, I remember that means I’m growing. Allow these emotions and circumstances to be stepping stones to growth.

?Visit Jeffrey Allen’s website to learn more about him and the training he offers. Jeffrey’s courses include Duality: Energy Training, Unlocking Transcendence: Awareness Training, and Spirit Mind Training. Also, sign up for his free Energy Healing Masterclass to discover four powerful energy healing techniques to attract abundance, love, health and happiness.

About Jeffrey Allen

Jeffrey Allen is a popular Mindvalley author and speaker, a powerful energy healer, and a pioneer in online energy training.

Jeffrey has taught hundreds of thousands of people how to harness the power of their own energy & awareness – to improve their relationships, deepen their spiritual connection, and increase their personal presence, happiness, and impact in the world.

Jeffrey’s mission is to make energy work & higher awareness available to everyone – so we can each unburden ourselves from needless conflict & pain, and embrace happy, fulfilled lives of true passion, purpose & meaning.

Disclaimer: The medical, fitness, psychological, mindset, lifestyle, and nutritional information provided on this website and through any materials, downloads, videos, webinars, podcasts, or emails is not intended to be a substitute for professional medical/fitness/nutritional advice, diagnoses, or treatment. Always seek the help of your physician, psychologist, psychiatrist, therapist, certified trainer, or dietitian with any questions regarding starting any new programs or treatments, or stopping any current programs or treatments. This website is for information purposes only, and the creators and editors, including Stephan Spencer, accept no liability for any injury or illness arising out of the use of the material contained herein, and make no warranty, express or implied, with respect to the contents of this website and affiliated materials.


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